Economic crises, sacrificed youth and poverty

Current Economy and Sustainable Development-compatible? GDP growth (at all costs), economic development, inflation ... How concillier the current economy with the environment and sustainable development.
User avatar
chatelot16
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 6960
Registration: 11/11/07, 17:33
Location: Angouleme
x 264

Re:




by chatelot16 » 03/06/16, 21:07

Did67 wrote:It is not clear what year the data is from.

We compare people born in 1975 (who are therefore almost 40 years old today! AND these would be the "young") to those born in 1925 (who are 90 years old) ???

Or is it in 2000? AND since, especially in Germany, the gaps have widened phenomenally, following the Hartz laws4 - read: http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%A9formes_Hartz

[Today, if you go to Berlin, you will be surprised to see people putting empty bottles on the curb. Explanation: Germany has opted for cleaning glass bottles (rather than breaking them to rectify the glass - which is silica which is not expensive and especially energy!), Therefore with a deposit; people "in a hurry" therefore put down the returnable bottle and a whole informal sector has developed of "bottle collectors" who are paid with the deposit ... !!!

http://www.biere-berlin-et-rocknroll.co ... onsignees/


it's German efficiency! a whole and usable bottle has more value than broken glass in a recycling container ... so will recuperate the bottle ... it's like the old EDF electromechanical counter, conscientiously destroyed in France, and in Germany checked and sold on amazon to serve as a measuring device for who needs it!

this is real ecology! when something can still be used it must be sold not destroyed!

the problem in france is that recovering to sell is frowned upon ... selling is almost more serious than stealing ...
0 x
User avatar
Exnihiloest
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 5365
Registration: 21/04/15, 17:57
x 660

Re: Economic crises, sacrificed youth and poverty




by Exnihiloest » 04/06/16, 17:37

Janic wrote:
Future questions will be how to distribute the wealth that robots will create, or what to do
It was the speech that accompanied the start of robotization replacing human labor. We see where it takes us ...

Yes, to magnificent progress, except for those nostalgic for pitsawyers, underground miners, itinerant agricultural workers, at grueling work of 50 or 60 hours / week.
Why should we ask a human, a job that can be done by a machine ?! That does not make any sense. It is even devaluing, except to prove that the human would have an added value when he does what the machine can do, which is far, very far, from being the general case.
0 x
User avatar
Exnihiloest
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 5365
Registration: 21/04/15, 17:57
x 660

Re: Economic crises, sacrificed youth and poverty




by Exnihiloest » 04/06/16, 17:44

Did67 wrote:Here is the age pyramid: just put it down, to have the same presentation as Langlet /

http://www.insee.fr/fr/themes/detail.as ... e_aide.htm

...

It is also necessary to add 10 years, the data are those of January 2006.
0 x
User avatar
Exnihiloest
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 5365
Registration: 21/04/15, 17:57
x 660

Re: Re:




by Exnihiloest » 04/06/16, 17:48

chatelot16 wrote:
Did67 wrote:...
this is real ecology! when something can still be used it must be sold not destroyed!

the problem in france is that recovering to sell is frowned upon ... selling is almost more serious than stealing ...

Totally agree. The recycling centers for example, should be accessible as well to those who discard, as to those who seek to re-use or re-sell.
0 x
User avatar
Did67
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 20362
Registration: 20/01/08, 16:34
Location: Alsace
x 8685

Re: Economic crises, sacrificed youth and poverty




by Did67 » 04/06/16, 18:01

Exnihiloest wrote:It is also necessary to add 10 years, the data are those of January 2006.


Heck then, I didn't pay attention. I thought INSEE had an up-to-date site ...
0 x
User avatar
Philippe Schutt
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 1611
Registration: 25/12/05, 18:03
Location: Alsace
x 33

Re: Economic crises, sacrificed youth and poverty




by Philippe Schutt » 10/06/16, 17:43

Is youth really sacrificed?
when I bought my apartment at 25, my salary was barely enough. We drove old cars, went on vacation with the family and restaurant outings were rare. When I see young people now, they want to buy without depriving them of anything. If they tightened their belts like we did, they could buy their homes much more easily than they did then.
I think it is a bad trial that we are being made there.
0 x
Ahmed
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 12298
Registration: 25/02/08, 18:54
Location: Burgundy
x 2963

Re: Economic crises, sacrificed youth and poverty




by Ahmed » 11/06/16, 11:44

It is better to reason in tandence rather than in periods: for example, during the "glorious thirties", phase of expansion of the middle class (and thus baptized by this same class), a good part of the popular classes remained in margin of the movement, knowing unenviable living conditions, however a dynamic was at work and all the more celebrated that hardly expressed that its beneficiaries.
Today, the structure of consumption has changed and overly symmetrical comparisons prove to be misleading. As for the dynamic, it has been reversed and the hope of continuous improvement has been replaced by the (well-founded) fear of irreversible deterioration: the challenge to the labor law constitutes a magnificent illustration, it is now for the most part trying to simply maintain the previous conditions, knowing that the other areas participate in the same logic, such as pensions, etc.
The extension of working hours, increased competition for employment, intensification of work (load equal to reduced staff), appearance of the phenomenon of uberisation and multiplication of odd jobs of survival are signs difficult to refute and which bear witness to a disturbing development which leaves more than one distraught.
0 x
"Please don't believe what I'm telling you."
Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 79121
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 10973

Re: Economic crises, sacrificed youth and poverty




by Christophe » 11/06/16, 13:16

Philippe Schutt wrote:When I see young people now, they want to buy without depriving them of anything. If they tightened their belts like we did, they could buy their homes much more easily than they did then.
I think it is a bad trial that we are being made there.


The INSEE figures, it's not me who invented them ... the price of housing has been multiplied by 3 compared to purchasing power since the 80s ... how can you say that it is "easy" ?

But what young people are you talking about?

Teens still at their parents 'house (in this case it is usually their parents' money ...)? The ones I call the facebook generation (spoiled rotten and completely ungrateful and whose social model is more based on social networks more than real life)? Yes they do not have to complain because their parents give them everything they want ...

[start mode 1/2 off topic]

We could also talk about the growing single parenthood (8/10 of the decision of the mother around me ...), here too it contributes to making a generation more spoiled than the others: 2 birthday gifts, 2 Christmas gifts, 2 times more holidays and outings ...

And these conn ** ses who, disturbed by their hormones and supported by society, decide to leave the "progenitor" obviously think that this will have no consequences on the development of the child ... I would play politics , I would put sanctions for the initiator of the family breakdown (except serious cases proven like alcoholism, drugs, violence ...)! Anyway, let's close the parenthesis ...

[end of mode 1/2 off subject]

The "young" of 25-45 years, them ... struggle much more! Despite the diplomas and qualifications ...
0 x
Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 79121
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 10973

Re: Economic crises, sacrificed youth and poverty




by Christophe » 11/06/16, 13:17

Ahmed wrote:The extension of working hours, increased competition for employment, intensification of work (load equal to reduced staff), appearance of the phenomenon of uberisation and multiplication of odd jobs of survival are signs difficult to refute and which bear witness to a disturbing development which leaves more than one distraught.


I couldn't have said it better ... of course :)
0 x
User avatar
Philippe Schutt
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 1611
Registration: 25/12/05, 18:03
Location: Alsace
x 33

Re: Economic crises, sacrificed youth and poverty




by Philippe Schutt » 11/06/16, 17:39

I'm talking about young adults, who work and buy real estate, their behavior compared to ours when we were in the same situation. Ditto for those who set up on their own: new car, new fully equipped van, professional brand tools, vacations, etc. They must be planted 1 or 2 times to set foot on the ground.
INSEE gives figures. Hourly minimum wage in 1983: 3.34 €, in 2016: 9.67 €
apartment price 80 m2 on the south of Strasbourg in 1983: 80700 € and in 2016 + -200000 € but better isolated etc ...
For me the report shows that it is rather easier today.
0 x

 


  • Similar topics
    Replies
    views
    Last message

Back to "Economy and finance, sustainability, growth, GDP, ecological tax systems"

Who is online ?

Users browsing this forum : No registered users and 108 guests