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bleusideral
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by bleusideral » 07/12/11, 12:29

Hi hi it turns sour and it heats up
laughing apart before was before is for the moment we are not at all ready to come back to it, except, except, obviously if the contagious disease of the financial crisis affects us all
In this case who will be able to self manage with the resources of our ancestors ?? ....
for the moment, the present weather, the water of the well is polluted, the forest guards stop you immediately if you collect a piece of wood, the pollution that it is thus nature is there and very present, then I think that "amateur" researchers have solutions at their fingertips, and I take my hat off, so we really need to take advantage of these "discoveries" and experiments of all kinds for our future, this is obviously not " from above "that we will have them !!!
finally we come back to say the simplest life is the best .....! as the example of a poor African who makes his fire with dried dung and who goes miles to find a pitcher of water serve as an example because they find the happiness of being happy with little, and the example of the help that we can bring, we little econo, is to see these faces amazed to discover tricks which seem harmless to us like simple solar ovens, among others, which will be able to remind us that our modern world with its modern wealth is very badly shared, but it is another debate, and I think that it is necessary to think like that !! !!
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by Former Oceano » 20/12/11, 16:28

Let's put aside the stories of wood fires, precarious habitats, etc.
The African has a way of life that can still correspond to an African society, but transplanted with us, this way of life would correspond to that of the homeless and to a lesser extent the Roma and is therefore not suitable.

For energy, criteria must be defined and used in a star diagram (an example below found via Gogol)

Image

to compare them. We assign a score to each criterion and the energy with the largest area could correspond to that which interests us.

The criteria should take into account:

-environmental impact (extraction / transport)
- impact on use (Carbon / fine particles / NOx / Dioxins balance)
- energy efficiency (production energy to be returned)
-availability (production cycles {ex D / N summer / winter}, imports)
-easy handling (for example: wood = log vs electric = switch)
-investment (for example: radiator at 30 € against automatic wood boiler at 4000 €)
- cost of use (free solar except circulator vs fuel)
-cost maintenance of facilities.

In short by comparing the energies and solutions so can make the choice that suits us.
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by dedeleco » 20/12/11, 18:07

Yes, we can define criteria (very high number), weights for each criterion, (variable depending on mentalities and history), to find the optimum.

The Roma and some homeless people will put freedom first by dropping comfort !!

When the sea starts to rise quickly, meters per century, with lots of CO2, the CO2 criterion will become the only one that counts, and it will be too late, the sea rises inexorably 70m over the next millennia, like thIt rose 120m between -15000 to -8000m inexorably inevitable, even then without human CO2, simply due to the intrinsic instability of the Earth's climate, increasing for a million years.

So the criteria are based on viewpoints, fashions, awareness and emergencies, like huge whole cities going underwater in less than a lifetime.

The type solution www.dlsc.ca storing summer heat underground for a long time, works just as well for heating winter (without CO2, pollution-free, consumption-free, ultra-simple use, in perpetuity, almost free and very comfortable), as well as for storing this heat at higher temperature to have concentrated solar power plants with continuous operation day and night, days without sun, with no fundamental technical unknowns to solve, no pollution, no CO2, no catastrophic risks like nuclear.

The only difficulty is to convince the minds that this seemingly harmless simple method works very well, with little loss for large volumes (thanks to the slow thermal diffusion advancing slowing like the square root of time), even for the solar power from thermal power plants.
Earth is free and much cheaper than molten salt for long-term heat storage.
The earth has much warmer volcanic pockets and therefore can store this heat at 300 or even 400 ° C, in the same way.

So solar thermal energy with underground storage to make it continuous without stopping (like the other nonrenewable energies) is the best absolute energy, without fundamental technological unknown.
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by elephant » 20/12/11, 18:22

deledeco said:

it will be too late, the sea rises inexorably 70m


However, there is still time to build a wall!

When the Flemings are drowned, it will be time to notify!

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by dedeleco » 20/12/11, 19:56

However, there is still time to build a wall!

The Japanese are rebuilding their walls against the next tsunami, 20 to 30m !!!
The last tsunami had submerged them all and demolished these walls from 5 to 10m !!

If we lived 15000 years ago, with the seas 100 meters lower, we would not stop for 5000 to 7000 years building walls to be raised from 2 to 4m per century, up to 100m high on all coasts, crossing the English Channel, the North Sea, Quebec, etc ... !!!
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by Former Oceano » 20/12/11, 20:14

We come back to the fable of the oak and the reed.
The oak resists and builds walls and this until nature is stronger.
The reed folds and adapts. No walls, but why not a floating city.

If not to return to the subject, it is in my opinion interesting to have a mix of energies to erase the disadvantages and add the advantages.

For electricity:
- Wind turbine, works day and night in windy weather.
-Cogeneration with a stirling with solar or thermal hot source (wood, biogas, geothermal).

For heat:
-Cogeneration during the production of electricity (cold source composed by cold water which heats up to give domestic hot water, and by the heating water circuit).
-Solar with storage in the ground or in biomass (wood, biogas)
-Geothermal energy.

In all cases, energy consumption must be reduced, using low-consumption devices and insulating.
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by dedeleco » 20/12/11, 20:53

Very good summary of ex-oceano of the essentials.

The Dutch build floating houses.

But tsunamis are so violent at 20 to 40 m high that small and large boats are massacred, and therefore floating houses are not the solution for the Japanese.
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by Former Oceano » 20/12/11, 23:11

Nothing can resist a tsunami or a rascal wave.
I was dissertating on the rise of the sea level. Wall against floating city, knowing that against an extreme event the one as the other will yield.
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bleusideral
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by bleusideral » 21/12/11, 12:55

Hello!
In the Netherlands already floating houses in anticipation of rising waters, normal for a country part of which is below sea level ... good example
the poorest Chinese who live in large junk on a whole network .... etc
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bleusideral
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by bleusideral » 21/12/11, 12:59

dedeleco wrote:The type solution www.dlsc.ca storing summer heat underground for a long time, works equally well for heating winter (CO2-free, pollution-free, consumption-free, ultra-simple use, perpetuity, almost free and very comfortable) solar thermal energy with underground storage to make it continuous without stopping (like the other nonrenewable energies) is the best absolute energy, without fundamental technological unknown.


This is what comes close to the launched theme, let's hope that there are some who develop it, already a good example of absolute energy!
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