The universal basic income or income: operating debate

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Rajqawee
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Re: Basic income or universal income: functioning, debate




by Rajqawee » 04/12/20, 10:41

Macro wrote:
Christophe wrote:Uh Macro ... reading you (and the others) I think that some here do not have the basics of what UNIVERSAL income is ...universal What do you think this means? : Mrgreen:


This is a universal and unconditional income reached by the entire population ... whether you work or not, whether you are a pensioner, whether you have 10 M € of assets, whether you are homeless, whether you are civil servant at 15h per week effective or self-employed at 70h ... it's the same ... you are entitled to UK!


I understood the answer well

Christophe wrote:Obviously the proportionality of your other income means that the UK will be more or less important to you!



: Mrgreen: : Mrgreen: : Mrgreen: : Mrgreen: universal they said for simplicity ...

Sorry....


Thank you for making me laugh. It's nice :D :D :D
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Re: Basic income or universal income: functioning, debate




by Christophe » 04/12/20, 10:59

Macro wrote:
Christophe wrote:Obviously the proportionality of your other income means that the UK will be more or less important to you!



: Mrgreen: : Mrgreen: : Mrgreen: : Mrgreen: universal they said for simplicity ...

Sorry....


It's all in the head !! : Mrgreen:
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Rajqawee
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Re: Basic income or universal income: functioning, debate




by Rajqawee » 04/12/20, 11:32

Wait....

I have the impression that there is a good atmosphere on this subject ... it's weird!
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Re: Basic income or universal income: functioning, debate




by Christophe » 04/12/20, 13:12

There is always and everywhere a good atmosphere on this forum !

No ? Was I wrong? : Mrgreen:
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Re: Basic income or universal income: functioning, debate




by Macro » 04/12/20, 13:38

Rather good atmosphere ....

Personally I am not complaining ... Because compared to some (see many) of you ... I have like who would say the mouth full .... That said ... I had a fucking 'relatively rigid education ... Or I was made to understand that the steaks to pay for your steak did not fall from the sky .... It's not at 49 years that I'm going to backtrack ... Would it be that out of respect for my old man's urn that I will flower regularly .... I have been employed for 31 years .... Civil service, hotel building, taxi industry .... Not a single one day remunerated otherwise than by a payslip .... So I am somebody ... Conditioned ....
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Re: Basic income or universal income: functioning, debate




by Rajqawee » 04/12/20, 16:46

Macro wrote:Rather good atmosphere ....

Personally I am not complaining ... Because compared to some (see many) of you ... I have like who would say the mouth full .... That said ... I had a fucking 'relatively rigid education ... Or I was made to understand that the steaks to pay for your steak did not fall from the sky .... It's not at 49 years that I'm going to backtrack ... Would it be that out of respect for my old man's urn that I will flower regularly .... I have been employed for 31 years .... Civil service, hotel building, taxi industry .... Not a single one day remunerated otherwise than by a payslip .... So I am somebody ... Conditioned ....


There is not necessarily a correlation either: 31 years old, master's degree graduate, not a day at the job center while 4 different jobs, still working for the state but as a contractual! Like what...
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Re: Basic income or universal income: functioning, debate




by Exnihiloest » 05/12/20, 17:34

Remundo wrote:
Exnihiloest wrote:
Remundo wrote:you can see it is complex and hazy.

In fact the UK has already existed in France for a long time. It's called RSA + APL. It was called RMI etc ... it takes place at the CAF (French automatic fund) subject to income.

564,78 € for a single person, it is completely insufficient. It does not allow to pay rent, food, glasses or to face any problem in life. Students are excluded ...
In addition the system is vicious: if the person has small incomes, these are deducted! Why then would she work ?!

except that you forget that the person benefits in addition to CMU and APL.

This is the theory.
The APL does not cover accommodation costs. At this price, there are none or more in university towns (the cheapest are quickly taken). And the student who has to leave his city for an internship in a company for two or three months, which is common, either abandon his accommodation for another if he does not want to pay both but will have little chance of finding any one during the school year upon his return, especially if he lacks the means. Added to this is the complication of supporting documents, a story of polluting life, delaying payments, and eliminating practical solutions, since all housing is not eligible for the APL.
On the CMU I read "Contact lenses are reimbursed up to an annual flat rate of € 39,48". : Lol: At this rate, it's worse than not reimbursing at all. This is to make believe that we would reimburse while we are reimbursing medlars.

can also point to restaurants of the heart or other soup kitchens (unsold from supermarkets ...)
...

Nothing to see. They are charitable works, not institutional. I find it a little strong to try to justify the institutional negligence because there would exist alternatives, which had to be mounted by people concerned with the public interest precisely because of this negligence!

And next to the housing problem or pseudo-medical costs like glasses, we see the municipalities wasting our local taxes which they increase every year, demolishing a speed bump one year to replace it with a baffle, the opposite the year. following, remaking lanes and directions of movement that nobody complained about, arranging unnecessary spaces for the brand image of the municipality and especially that of its mayor ... In terms of practical help and useful expenses for those really to help, there will remain Emmaus or the restaurants of the heart.
The kicks in the heart ... are lost, even more against that of decentralized power than centralized power.
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Re: Basic income or universal income: functioning, debate




by Remundo » 05/12/20, 23:09

So guys ... yeah it's great the UK, it's huge, societal caviar, individual freedom, social, economic, in short the Holy Grail, as I read "we se will ask how we could have done without before ".

OOOKAYYY!
Remundo wrote: And we also have to see how we will finance the UK. If it's endless debt, or if it's additional taxes. A little of both probably, both are harmful.

So, additional debt or taxes? Cheese AND dessert. : Mrgreen:

I am going to tell you, for me the UK is a shady thing because desired by both the gauchos and also by the ultraliberals ... who never specify the funding. : roll:
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Re: Basic income or universal income: functioning, debate




by Exnihiloest » 06/12/20, 19:12

Remundo wrote:So guys ... yeah it's great the UK, it's huge, societal caviar, individual freedom, social, economic, in short the Holy Grail, as I read "we se will ask how we could have done without before ".

OOOKAYYY!

It's called the scarecrow fallacy.
It consists in reformulating the opposing thesis by simplifying and distorting it, and then in criticizing it since it is then much easier. Who says fallacy says false reasoning.

Remundo wrote:
And we also have to see how we will finance the UK. If it's endless debt, or if it's additional taxes. A little of both probably, both are harmful.

So, additional debt or taxes? Cheese AND dessert. : Mrgreen:

I am going to tell you, for me the UK is a shady thing because desired by both the gauchos and also by the ultraliberals ... who never specify the funding. : roll:

First, pay taxes. Isn't it claimed that GAFAs wouldn't pay their taxes?
Then that the centralized power regains control over taxation and its use, and no longer lets the municipalities, departments and regions do anything about spending. There is a great deal of waste on their part, not only in the allocation of the budget by choices that do not promote the general interest of the republic but specific local interests, but also in the jobs themselves in the regions used for manage this decentralization. See eg. https://lexpansion.lexpress.fr/actualit ... 89057.html or this book which revealed the extent of the mismanagement, especially in jobs: https://www.lepoint.fr/economie/les-ver ... 785_28.php . And I'm not even talking about embezzlement.

Managed in this way, a private company would have already gone bankrupt. But with our taxes, it's easy, you just have to increase them. I heard a mayor interviewed daring to say: "we have spent more, so it's normal to increase local taxes"! In the same vein: "I made more purchases this year, it is normal to increase my salary", here is where is the stupidity of all these small local potentates who have no competence to manage a budget and often not the necessary ethics either. I'm not saying that centralization is the panacea, but at least we have an economy of scale, and in the event of a problem we know whose fault is.

So before talking about additional taxes for a new UK budget, it might be good if your requirements first apply to obtaining efficient, thrifty, and job-free management of the existing budget ( and while the national civil service is often understaffed). Without so much waste linked to the fragmentation of decentralized management (regions, departments, municipalities ...) and the absence of serious controls, it is perhaps the UK that we could pay instead of the RSA. And there I only pointed out a flagrant sector, but there are others, mismanagement, and also centralized (see how much costs a former president of the republic, the allowances of deputies or others).
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Re: Basic income or universal income: functioning, debate




by Remundo » 07/12/20, 01:00

ah because you think that the GAFA will invest to pay the UK of the French?

ultimately for convenience jobs, yes they could be fired and placed in the UK; namely to replace a "mismanagement" by another ...

the heart of the matter is all the same to pay people for nothing ... and in addition to housing them, looking after them ... it's ambitious.
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